I havI have been practising for three weeks now with my new Yamaha 674H, with it's EC cut headjoint.
For the moment I play with all holes plugged, as I prefer to concentrate on other aspects (and problems) I have.
The sound on this instrument is in general amazing, in spite of my rather poor technic.
But I have some problems that I believe come from the EC cut, being so different than the M2 I was used to. They are related to the quality of the sound of some notes, instability of the intonation on long notes and in general, the need to learn a new embouchure and positioning.
I observed that this headjoint sounds much better if the pressure against the chin is considerably weaker than (only reference I have) the Gemmy M2 I had been playing for three years. Also, the lighter I press on the keys, the better. I suppose his comes from the high quality of the instrument as a whole.
But on a few notes I have not been able to find out how to improve the quality of the sound:
D2sharp, for example usually sounds too airy and very different and lower quality that D2.
Sometimes I have problems in getting a decent E2, as it tends to fold back to E1 quite easily.
In general, I notice that covering more or less the blowing hole has a critical effect on the sound quality, something that did not happen with the old M2. I still don't know what is the best position of the headjoint in reference to the flute body, as it seems to be so critical.
All of these problems are surely related with my playing and not with the instrument, so I would much appreciate your comments and help on how to improve on it.
Thanks...e been practising with my new Yamaha 674H, with it's EC cut headjoint.
The sound on this instrument is amazing, in spite of my poor technic.
But I have some problems that I believe come from the EC cut. The refer to quality of the sound of some notes, unstablitity of the intonatin on long notes nad in general, the need to learn a new embochoure and positioning.
I observe taht this headjooint souds better if the pressure against the chin is considerably weaker thsn (only reference I have) the Gemmy M2 I had been playing for three years. Also, the lighter I press on the keys, the better. I suppose his comes from the high quality of the instrument as a whole.
But on a few notes I have no been able to find how to improve the quality of the sound:
D2sharp, for example usually sounds too airy and very different and worst that D2. I also have problems in getting a decent E2, as it tends to fold back to E1 quite easily. In general I notice that cobvering more or less the blowing hole has critical effect on the sound quiality, somethingtaht did not happen with the old M2. I still don't know what is the best position of the headjoint in reference to the flute body, as it seems to be quite critical.
All of these problems are surely related with my playing and not with the isntrument, so I would much appreciate your comments and help on how to improve on it.
<Added>
Sorry, I screw it up (my fault). Will post again below:
I have been practising for three weeks now with my new Yamaha 674H, with it's EC cut headjoint.
For the moment I play with all holes plugged, as I prefer to concentrate on other aspects (and problems) I have.
The sound on this instrument is in general amazing, in spite of my poor technic.
But I have some problems that I believe come from the EC cut, being so different than the M2 I was used to. They are related to the quality of the sound of some notes, instability of the intonation on long notes and in general, the need to learn a new embouchure and positioning.
I observed that this headjoint sounds much better if the pressure against the chin is considerably weaker than (only reference I have) the Gemmy M2 I had been playing for three years. Also, the lighter I press on the keys, the better. I suppose his comes from the high quality of the instrument as a whole.
But on a few notes I have not been able to find out how to improve the quality of the sound:
D2sharp, for example usually sounds too airy and very different and lower quality that D2.
Sometimes I have problems in getting a decent E2, as it tends to fold back to E1 quite easily.
In general, I notice that covering more or less the blowing hole has a critical effect on the sound quality, something that did not happen with the old M2. I still don't know what is the best position of the headjoint in reference to the flute body, as it seems to be so critical.
All of these problems are surely related with my playing and not with the instrument, so I would much appreciate your comments and help on how to improve on it.
Not being a master teacher, I cannot offer many suggestions to help with your problems, but I do have a couple ideas that might help. I played on a Yamaha with an EC cut head for a couple years, and I discovered that it sounded much better if you the headjoint rolled in more than is necessary on other flutes (covering more of the embouchure hole than you might be accustomed to). I've been told that a good general rule is to cover about 30% of the embouchure hole, but on the EC head, I found that 50% or more needed to be covered to produce the optimum sound. That's just my experience, though, so you might find the exact opposite. Now as for the headjoint needing to be in a certain position in relation to the body, this is really up to you. I suggest you view the headjoint as a separate entity from the body when it comes to positioning. Find the angle that produces the best sound, regardless of where the body might be when you achieve this. Then find the most comfortable angle for the body to be in, and combine the headjoint and body in such a way that maintains these angles. If you mean that you haven't found the optimum amount pull the head out, I found that this is particularly important to producing a good tone on the EC head for some reason. I used the headjoint out just about 1 mm, so you could try that, but since we're not the same player, that's just a starting place. I would also tend to regard instability of intonation as a problem related to inconsistent air speed. If you have a tuner, do long tones trying to hold the needle perfectly still and in tune. This gives a visual aspect to air support that can help understand what needs to be done to correct inconsistent intonation. I hope some of this helps!
Glad you are enjoying your new beauty!!!!
I play on a yamaha 681 with a cy, but I went throught some adjustment pains that sound similar to yours.
I had the same problem with the D#. It sounded awful and airy. For me, aiming the airstream up a little higher helped, but mostly I needed more intercostal support. Once I gave it that umph it needed, its tone blends in great with the surrounding notes and it's in tune. I have to do the same with d.
I don't recommend turing in more to correct your problems. It will impede your future success. Get used to playing turned out. In the end you will have a better tone, more control, and incredible dynamics if you work on it. A book on tone development is essential to play your beauty at full potential. I recomment the tone book by trevor wye. There might be others out there but it's what I used so I can attest to it. It's money very well spent.
A lighter touch is better, not only for your flute, but for your technique, particuarly while executing fast passages.
I hate playing an open hole plugged up. Don't be afraid of the open holes and take the plugs out! Give yourself a period of adjustment, but you might find those little plastic pieces are more problems than they're worth. Many times people are unsure how they'll respond to the open holes, but find they adjust quite readily. Also, an open hole forces you to play with rather correct hand position. Why waste time practicing with poor hand position with the plugs in?
Playing well means that sometimes you have to adapt to the equipment you have even if what is necessary does not seem logical. I agree that with most flutes you should not cover the embouchure hole that much, but I did find the best tone control and dynamic range with the headjoint in a bit more than usual, and it certainly does not appear to have impeded my learning, so I still encourage you to try it, Jose Luis. I also have to question the statement that playing an open hole flute forces better hand position. It certainly forces you to cover the holes to produce any kind of decent tone, but how could a flute maker (at least for a non-custom flute), know what the proper hand position is for me? If you have short or thin fingers the holes can be quite difficult to cover completely, but the fact that you are physically unable to cover the holes does not mean you are necessarily playing with poor hand position. The holes are there to allow pitch shading and extended techniques, not to teach proper hand position.
Thanks for your useful comments. My teacher told me that she had to play "more open" (cover less) when she switched to her present Miramatsu. She believes the Mira has the same (or very) similar) to the EC. Do you agree?
The issue of covering or not the open holes is something I will postpone to next year. I decided to buy open holes because I thought it would force me to correct some finger positions, particularly the RH annular (for D) as sometimes I hit the trill inadvertently and spoil the note. I understand the holes are not there for that, but they could help, I guess. Anyway, I have tried for a couple of weeks with 3 holes open, but I had to plug the G and the D from the very beginning to get a reasonable sound quality.
But right now I must concentrate on the coming end of the year "concert", on June 9!. Opening the holes would be too much of an additional difficulty, as I have always studied with a closed hole instrument. But I will try again when I have more time ahead for learning brand new things.
I will play the Allegro of Stamitz duet II Op 27, with my teacher as second flute. I tend to get very nervous and really I would refuse to do it, were it not that I know I must get used to play with public and overcome the stress and the fear of failure.
Practising how to recover from errors and continue playing was important for me in this process. As a trick, I imagine that I am already playing with public and this increases the stress and shows me were the weakest points are. (it works for me!)
For recovering from errors, I play with (though sometimes, against) a recording of the second flute. If I make an error or get lost (sometimes I read the wrong staff), the recording obviously will not stop and I am forced to recover at any price.
Jose Luis,
Time improves things. Work on long tones.
For placement of the head joint in relation to the body, I would atempt to tune the various octaves. Some aren't aware that moving the head joint not only tunes the note but also changes the tuning relation of all of the notes. So having the head joint at an odd location would make a flute play out of tune with itself. Probably start tuning with the F..As in tune F2, F1, F2, F3, F2. Change to G and tune similar octaves. I prefer tuning notes which have about half the holes closed going down the tube. They are more of an average of what the flute will do. Then try other notes. If you tune an Eb or a C# first, you'll only get confused.
Many players spend a lot of time on long tones and the famous Moyse exercise, De La Sonorite. (Ask your teacher about this) The problem with Moyse De La Sonorite for most is that they get stuck on one exercise in the book and never play the others. Listen as you play for this sonority between the notes while you play scales and slow pieces. Listen for tone, tuning and volume. Try playing your scales in octaves slurred. C1-C2,D1-D2, E1-E2,....It's good for the embouchure.
Generally I'd compare the Muramatsu sound to be more similar to Haynes but maybe a tad stronger. The Yamaha sound is maybe closer to Powell but the EC cut head is a bit darker than the CY on my instruments. Generally the yamahas that I have are more powerful than the Muramatsu flutes that I've played. THe Yamaha may be probably more in line with today's concepts of modern flute tone BUT the Muramatsu line is an excellent example of fine Japanese craftsmanship and design as far as I'm concerned. The real issue is getting the larger Yamaha blow hole under control so that the tail isn't wagging the dog and this takes a bit of embouchure work.
This fear of failure that you mention is what generally amplifies the adrenaline /nervous feeling. Practice well. Try to memorize the piece. It's OK to be nervous beforehand but if you are confident in your work, you have no reason to fear failure and get nervous in the performance. Pretty much everyone gets nervous. A few day before the performance, try to make yourself nervous by imagining yourself in performance. This may help to get over the nerves. Maybe even play for your family or frineds. Then in the actual performance, use this experience to examine your problems as they tend to get larger on stage and work on these problems in practice later.
Lack of air pressure (and the embouchure to turn this into a clean, fast airstream, like the clean, non-turbulent flame of an oxyacetylene welder)is a cause of many problems, which would include much of what you describe.
People who play with lack of air pressure tend to resort to covering the embouchure hole more with their lip, because to cover less would place the lip aperture further from the far edge of the embouchure hole, hence using a region of the airstream where turbulence interfered with good tone control.
flutist06,
Please allow me to elaborate regarding the comment on correct hand positions and open holes.
In my experience alone, when in the presence of other flutists who play closed hole flutes, more times than not, their hands and fingers are all over the place. I've even seen one woman (who is a fairly proficient player) play with not even the tips of her fingers, but used the areas of her fingers near her middle knuckles to close the lids. Sure, it got the job done, but did it hinder her technique? Most likely. I find that even when I switch back to closed holes on my old flute, I tend to get a little sloppy. But as soon as I'm back on the open hole, it forces me to clean up my act and play with correct hand position, or else it's apparent immediately! Missed or poor notes! On a closed hole, sometimes poor hand position isn't noticed until a glance at the hands is taken. During practice times, glancing at our hands or mentally checking our finger placement isn't as high on our list as it should be, at least mine lol.
That's all I meant by that comment.
Alright. I didn't mean to come across as attacking you, and if that's what you read into my post, I apologize....I just wanted to point out that while a French flute can encourage BETTER hand position, it does not necessarily produce CORRECT position.
Most (people including kids)here play on closed hole flutes, and have very acceptable, comfortable finger positions, that are not a limiting factor as they progress. That is probably because almost every one of them is taught by an accomplished flute player. It has little to do with holes through keys.
Re: Time to ask for some help on the EC cut 04:35 on Wednesday, May 24, 2006
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Account Closed (3248 points)
Correct? Better?
These are pretty arbitrary terms.
It seems like a lot of things are to you Micron, but who knows how you think. I think you would have made a great Lawyer.
I do see both sides to it and have to agree with a little of both. Both have valid points. This topic always seems to be open for debate with flutists, so no one is right or wrong here.
I was suggested to memorize the piece in oder to feel more confident. I would like to be able to do that, but so far I never could play more than 3 or 4 notes before not knowing how to continue.
Now, all masters and most professsionals do play without the score.
I think this raises an interesting issue:
What methods do you use to memorize a piece?
I give below a few ideas that occur to me (I give them my own names, excuse me if some are not correct):
- "body memory" (practically without conscious finger positions, I used that with Classic Guitar but many years ago). Or perhaps,
- learning the sequence of notes names and then playing them in real time? Or,
- photographic memory, if you have that gift, (seeing the complete staffs passing by with eyes closed)? or maybe,
- being able to play directly based on the melody you remember (something like on the fly playing but by ear)?
searching...
e been practising with my new Yamaha 674H, with it's EC cut headjoint.
