Um...I heard in another topic that inline keys cause problems later in life?? I have a Gemeinhardt 3SH thats inline so if I keep playing it does that mean I'll be feeling pain in the next few years? Does offset get rid of this problem?

Ive been playing inline for 3 years and i have no problem with my fingers...people with shorter fingers prefer offset keys then people with long fingers

I've been playing an inline flute since 99' and I have had no injuries so far. Like already said plugging the G can be useful for a while. Or on the odd occasion plug it depends on how long you are going to be practising and how you are feeling - tired fingers ectera..

Its just a case of managing how you play, you shouldn't get any injuries.

I take lessons and my teacher says my posture is fine, and I don't have trouble covering the G hole, I just don't want some tunnel thing in my hands/arms/wherever it is!!! plus the plugs I have are really crappy.

I've tried playing my friends offset Yamaha, but I hated how the offset key feels! It just seems uncomfortable. And have to say, open holes are one of the best features of a flute. I love playing the quarter-tones and for some reason the low notes sound better.

"For some reason the low notes sound better."
I really, really doubt that the open holes make the low notes sound better. The lowest notes have all of the open-hole keys closed, until you get up past an Eb.
Quite likely a better headjoint design makes the low notes sound better.

You will probably be fine with your inline G. You can plug that particular hole, and also get a Bo-pep to make the left hand grip essentially larger. What is most important, is that you will have achiness and possibly tingling in your hand well before you do enough damage to have carpal tunnel syndrome. If you practice a LOT (like 3 or 4 hours a day) and your hand is getting achy, you would need to change your flute setup. But don't worry about it if your hand doesn't hurt when you play for really long stretches.

"In-line is mechanically quite inferior. So is it worth it, for the fashion statement? A bit like stiletto heels really. :-)"

Please understand that I'm not advocating one over the other. One issue with the inline G is that it may be slightly less supported in the mechanics but that if the player closes the keys properly it isn't an issue and it could be that a tad lighter key work or a tad simpler may be good thing.

I've been playing inlines for about 30 years and (knock on wood) no carpal tunnel as yet. Some days up to 8 hours of practicing that has been generally technical stuff.

One issue with off-set G is that if a person thinks that it is easier to cover the G hole (Which is marginally offset by a very small distance....) they will not bother to reach that pinky finger to that G key very well. This will cause them to actually not cover the hole effectively even though they have bought this flute for that purpose. I have seen this in action.

The other more serious issue is that with off-set G flutes people will tend to have their wrist and the back of their hand more inline with their forearm. This causes,
1)A tendency to push the flute up against their chin or mistakenly their bottom lip too hard.
2)A decrease in technical coordination because their flute support mechanism becomes confused with their finger action and this causes an increase in tension.

If the L.H. is more underneath the tube slightly, the fingers are freed up to perform the correct function of opening and closing the keys without undue stress.

~bilbo
N.E. Ohio

Actually Micron, I am very serious and dedicated to my technique and not "clutching at straws".

One issue with having an off-set hand position (Not speaking of the keys but the hands and fingers here) is that this WILL deflect the mechanism off it's pivot line and cause undue wear on the mechanism in time (similar to having an unbalanced crank shaft on an engine) as well as wasted energy of off-line finger motion. This is a primary issue that many can have with inline mechanisms with respect to the G.



<Added>

"0.0002" becomes quite significant."
Seriously? So if a mechanism is that tight, there just about isn't room for any oil. I seriously wonder how many old student line flutes are generally repaired to that sort of tolerances in the L/R setup of the action.

"Having the G keys mounted on the Bb key's pivot rod makes that whole assembly significantly more flexible, easily to a degree of 0.0002" hence non-rigid."

The issue that we are discussing centers around the 3rd finger G key and the 2nf finger A keys. So my point is that there is a slight difference in the mechanism in this regards but that if the player closes the keys properly it really isn't going to be an issue. With the off-set G it would be more important for this increased rigidity because there is a tendency for a fair number of players who "need" this setup to cover the holes to play in a way that they are inadvertently deflecting those keys. So for them, the off-set G is an advantage because they gain a sense of security in covering the holes as well as having a more robust mechanism that in spite of the strong possibility of a less efficient hand position, will maintain it's alignment for a longer period of time.

I grew up on the standard closed hole offset G through public school and didn't have a problem with it but now after many years of playing in line I definitely feel uncomfortable playing off set G flutes. The balance with them isn't correct for me any more.

...and I bet the poor soul who originally posed the question is more confused than ever now.

Well, the main thing is really not to worry about playing inline unless it hurts, and if it does, get help- do NOT ignore pain.

Good point MT..
Worry about how the G key is bolstered up with extra posts while the A key isn't any more supported on an offset flute is relatively less important.
"
Um...I heard in another topic that inline keys cause problems later in life?? I have a Gemeinhardt 3SH thats inline so if I keep playing it does that mean I'll be feeling pain in the next few years? Does offset get rid of this problem?"

The simple answer is,.......... no. Whatever that problem is. The difference in the location of that G key is relatively minimal to the ergonomics issue. It's more important how you practice, how much you practice and your genetic predisposition towards joint or tendon issues.

Ok thats a bit more simple. I practice a lot, and I just got my inline flute this past Christmas, but had been playing offset a year before that. Hasn't been hurting, so I guess I'll just keep playing until it does. Thanks for the help!

"...... I practice a lot, and I just got my inline flute this past Christmas, but had been playing offset a year before that. Hasn't been hurting, so I guess I'll just keep playing until it does. Thanks for the help!"

TenorSax13,
That is part of my point in this thread. If you are the type of flute player who practices a lot daily (Like 4 or more hours of intense daily finger motion) then you may want to pay attention to your hand position, amount of finger pressure that you use and the effect of this practice workout on your body such as the feel of your muscles, tendons and joints. In this aspect we have to think like athletes with respect to the daily workout routine.
For example, slapping the keys harder won't provide a stronger attack to the tone if your flute is working properly. It may tend to influence the alignment of the pads or give you pain eventually. ON the other hand, moving the fingers too slowly provides a weak transition to the legato passages. A player like Rampal would have his fingers pop up instead of just raise.

Tension in the hand comes from keeping the muscles activated. (As in clamping them down).

One of the difficult things in technique is that lifting the fingers takes more than putting them down. Our hands are designed to grasp and those muscles are stronger than the release muscles. Opening the fingers involves muscles which aren't generally well developed in size and coordination. The other issue is that certain fingers use the same basic tendons. Try moving your pinkey without moving the ring fingers. These things are what makes certain fingerings difficult to master such as the High F#3 to high A3 (back and forth) or the mid line B1 to D2/C to Eb etc. This is also the primary rationale behind our trill fingerings. Very few trill fingerings require opposite finger motions even if they are between different hands. The higher C-D is a good example.

So I had heard that one of the things that separated Rampal form other players is that while playing slower passages he moved his fingers just as quickly between the notes as faster tempos. Or in other words, he held the notes longer and changed to the next note faster than most players.

So yes of course, avoid any unnecessary tension. Only try to use tension of any muscle that is required in an appropriate amount. ~This one concept for some can be a lifetime of study. The other one is that playing a wind instrument is simply and basically about the sound. So, study great flute sound well and become a master of your sound. These things may sound really dumb or simple to some but I think that they should be the the underlying essence of any great player.

I've found that the main problem with your wrist being out of alignment is NOT due at all to the fact that it's offset or inline.

The two most important things are where you place your thumb and fingers on your right hand as if this is done poorly, you can't maintain proper posture and proper left hand alignment. I find that a thumb rest is a godsend and rotating the foot joint a bit more helps keep my shoulders in a more comfortable position.