Thanks Chris - that's true.

These are keys I have yet to find any repertoire suitable for my grade to play!

Karab. - Chris has posted a list of recommendations this year on his website for alto flutes. The intermediate ones cover the popular brands, like Dean Yang, Pearl, Jupiter Dimedici, Trevor James, as well as the more expensive ones.

Would C concert flute recommendations differ? I guess so, given the wider range of C concert flutes out there. The Trevor James & Dimedici intermediate flutes seem to be the best bang for the buck.

Chris is a woman :-)

What is the website?

Referencing to a post made earlier in this thread:

If you are dropping a considerable amount of money on an intermediate flute, I *highly* recommend getting an open-holed flute. You can practice with plugs in until you feel comfortable taking them out. A lot of flutists take them out one at a time to ease the transition to open-holed. Don't let a salesperson talk you into another close-holed because they know in a few years you will be yearning to come in and drop some more money on an open-holed.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not spend lots of money on another closed holed flute if you are serious about playing!! You are doing yourself an injustice.

I went to Japan this summer, and played with Japan TV MBC-youth orchestra, all their flutists are using Closed Holes. Also, all the flutes in Japan's music stores are closed holes, Sankyo 201, 301, 401, 501 and all high end brands, all are closed holes.

I think open holes are more of a national habit or trend or fashion or marketing?

I think a Muratmatsu EX or Sankyo 201 is very very good for the thread starter's choice! They both very sweet toned flute, you will never regret it.

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I used to use closed holes, and now I switched to open hole, because closed holes made my finger position terrible and ugly! The only good advantage for open hole is that it forces you to have a good finger positions.

Pyrioni: I am curious... How many years have the students in the youth orchestra been playing? Also, how old are they? I would venture to guess that many students who have not hit their growth spurt would not purchase open-holed models because they cannot successfully cover the holes.

They are 16-18, played around 6-8 years, I am 16, played 7 years.

But I have seen many many China's kids (6-9) play open hole very well. It is like in USA, they think open holes are for professional players.

For kids, play open hole is not a big problem, kids have good memory on positions.

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it took me only 1 month to fully adapt to open hole, 8 months ago:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwGIXUn8v0Y

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I heard from teachers that adults need average 3 month to successfully switch to open hole, teenages need 1 month, kids below 10 need only 2 weeks.

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What I mean is it is not a big deal to use Closed Hole now, as you can always change to open hole easily when it's neccessary. (my teachers said this, they are principal and asst principal of a professional orchestra)

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My cousin she started flute at 7 years old, with Open Hole, she won local junior championship twice. She used Muramatsu GX open hole.

Hmm, that is interesting. My hands were so small when I was young that I had a hard time reaching keys, let alone covering holes!

Oh forgot to mention, my cousin's flute is in-line. That's even tougher for her. But trust me, kids can manage easily.

The best player I ever knew personally had a custom Powell *inline* closed-hole flute(special ordered it with closed holes) as his main instrument. Speed and spot-on tone control were the main reasons, because a pad always seals more reliably during quick passages and while doing things like jazz and so on than your fingers.

Look, like most things in life, music is more than 75% marketing and trying to make money. If people can make contra-bass flutes out of PVC pipe and PVC pipe is good enough for the Blue Man Group to use in their performances, then material isn't going to make any real difference compared to construction. And sound tests prove this as well. Metal flutes sound like metal, wood like wood, glass like glass, and PVC like PVC, and so on. But these are minor differences such that beyond the basic type, our ears just won't notice.(or more specifically anyone in your audience over 20 won't possibly be able to tell)

So knowing this, you can save a lot of money and frustration by concentrating on the basics.

1 - scale and construction of the body matters. What it's made out of doesn't. Some instruments have superior scaling and quality control. Some just are mediocre. Some have keys, features, and gimmicks that you want or don't want.(split E comes to mind as a love/hate option for many). But they all are basically a tube with holes and mechanisms to cover them.

2 - 80-90% of the sound is created by the mouthpiece/headjoint on instruments. Spend your money here. Also, try out the headjoint. Even among the same model, there will be a wide difference in how it plays. Some project more, some are quicker, and some are just no good. Feel no shame in trying out, say, all ten Yamaha headjoints that the shop has before buying the best one for you.

3 - If you have an interest in a specific model like an Alto flute, get it. It will set you apart and allow you to explore new and interesting things. Also, in the case of an alto flute, you can do a lot of music that you can't with a standard flute, as most music for voice and orchestra has a treble part that is voices like an alto type instrument. The C flute is actually a bit of an anomaly compared to the massive numbers of Bb and Eb instruments out there.

3a - An Alto flute can also double with some work like a C flute in 99% of normal music, because the last half of the third octave isn't really used on a flute since that's normally just written for piccolo. You'll have to use all four octaves on an alto flute, but it really can be done and is an incredibly versatile instrument in the right hands. I don't know of anyone who has one that has regretted the choice. IMO, it should be the default choice but I think it's because it's incredibly hard for a young player to start off with that it isn't.

4 - Used is always an option. I got my son's first Yamaha for $235 in near mint condition as an ex-rental from a local shop. The previous player had used it for one year in school and quit. The pads still have 5-6 years in them, the finish is like new, and it plays very well. Avoid Ebay and the like, of course, and deal with a good shop.

You know, I have always heard people say that open-holed flutes play better and are more professional, but after reading what you guys have said as well as another forum's debate on it (Sax on the Web)... I think you all have swayed my opinion!

I have only played flute for 7 years (4 yrs not seriously, 3 yrs serious).

for myself:

- Closed hole sounded just like Open hole, no difference
- But Open hole is very good for correcting finger positions
- Closed hole gives me very bad finger positions
- Materials make not much difference to sound (only very tiny)
- Flute body makes not too much difference to sound (some)
- Split E is very useful for stable and smoother and even high notes (because your high E doesn't stick out and make your lips tight for other high notes)
- B foot is very important for 4th octave notes only (4th octave notes much easier to come out with B-foot flutes)
- Inline makes no difference at all to sound

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so I am very happy with my now flute: Sankyo 401 open,B-foot,split-E,offset-G :)

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If you choose a Closed hole flute that is OK, as you can always correct your finger position in a matter of 1 to 3 months at most in future, no worries :)


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If you are worried about open holes may not give you a perfect seal during fast passages, don't worry, please re-check our video link above, I was only lightly touching my open holes on my flight of bumblebees at tempo of 280 (4 notes each beat!), still no leaks for me. As I said it'll only take you 1-3 months to get used to it, and then the holes make your finger position perfect, forces you to cover them accurately every time you move your fingers, even in very very fast tempos, no prob,

No problem at all, teacher Micron, yes, you are very very right, I shouldn't blame the flute, it was ME who is very lazy to press on the center of the key. But Closed hole flute gave me this chance to be lazy Open hole made me to cover on the dead center.

Forgot to check this thread. Wow everyone's having this "open hole/closed hole" conversation.